Recording and presentations: Solar Heat for Industry in Morocco and Tunisia

03 December 2019

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Automated transcription (it may contain errors)


I think it’s time to get started. So, right, so let’s get our panellists to introduce themselves briefly in a couple of sentences. So Abdulkadir if you could start by introducing yourself very briefly.

Thank you, Carlos. I am a quarterback coach,

process engineer and the head of solar heat department in the National Agency of energy conservation. I work in the sense to sound and when and

noble energy and energy efficiency expand and lead auditor

15,000 DWANE so that’s all and thank you again for inviting me to speak in this webinar.

Thank you, Kara, and Fatima, could you please introduce yourself briefly and get ready to present

you’ll be the first 2% hello everybody I am she had for them Sarah I am animation I learned this

from the Moroccan solar cluster and I will talk today about the potential of the concentrated solar heat in Morocco. I want to thank you, Carlos and Adam for

for the opportunity that you let us to organise this webinar and for your interest for this team. Thank you very much. Thank you very much Fatima so

well whenever you are ready to start sharing your screen.

And start with your presentation.

And for those of you who arrived a little bit late, just a small reminder, so you will get the video recording and the presentation slots. So well backing that over to you.

Today I’m going to present the opportunities of Morocco for industrial application of CSP and csh. Today, the Moroccan energy situation is pushing for a diversification of energy sources, a sharp rise of energy consumption and energy mix that is predominately for sale and energy dependence on oil and gas inputs. As you can see, in this short the distribution of primary sources in Morocco,

Morocco has

Established ambitious,

ambitious strategy to all the technologies with a role for the CSP providing dispatchable green electricity meeting the needs of the national operator.

In 2009.

There was an objective to to reduce the energy inputs from 95% to 85%.

From 2009 to 2020. Morocco produced 40% electricity needs via solar energy, and there was an energy increase of 42% of renewable energy.

maraca Morocco’s aims is to achieve 52% over in double

Power is styled by tweeny church

for integrated project development, for as far as the electricity production concern, there are a minimum of their aim of 52% capacity for industrial integration. There there is that competence of local industry for local development for inclusive development and training and add for all the mastery technologies and qualification. The aim is to create an ecosystem contributing to the socio economic development of the country by combining technologies to provide the best answers to identify the needs optimising the cost of kill water and maximising its synergies.

This is B has several advantages

Then TV, on hits and cold production, storage, electricity production, then trubin and is also thermal and the thermal dynamite thermodynamic sports.

There are different technologies on the CSP tree of the most relieving technologies have been selected. For small capacities projects are particularly parabolic troche.

This this is a Mitch made sure technology, modeller and low demand for metalia. For Frederick reflectors each Metro technology to his modular better land use facture and using the shuttle and there is also this design, which very modular, more adaptable to different types of Overleaf, and its technology is the most often used 75%

of the projects worldwide. And finally, there is central towers and hideousness

a study was carried out by eBay and allowed to divide the sectors with high potential of the study was completed by field service of industrials in text tool and food industry. several processes school is suitable for the installation on our CSP csh system for the production and supply of heads. Each process remains specific and requires precise demonstrating and and a precise interval hit requirements process. As you can see, in this table, each process in the industry have a temperature edge

There there is some example of projects in strategy in Morocco. The first one is CAPAC is a partial heating of cleaning solutions. For part of the diary is a power of 15 kilowatts or CMO of produce produced 112 mega ultra per year. It’s a project for nice finances by and large Is it the second one, it’s bigger than the first one is installed in the house emoji Mohawk is a soft power of 3.9 mega water to produce once you go into per year, additional production of electricity using an organic fluid.

The Moroccan industry today take an important place in the national construction of the energy it’s about 27

percent of the country. The industrial sector is a major consumer of the country’s energy.

Today process hit accounts for 75% of industries energy consumption worldwide, and industry requirements for very diverse hits temperature, therefore virile evidence for the CSP.

As you can see, it’s a breakdown of energy demand by sector in Morocco.

As you can see in this graph, there is 500 valence industrial sectors in Morocco, the chemical industry, the nonmetallic mineral products industry, the food industry, the textile industry and the rubber and plastics industry were selected. And according to Joker, cherry on the

portions of the sector in Morocco and the adequacy in terms of temperature between the needs of the processes and the production capacities of the CSP technologies.

The analysts take also into account the needs of each sectors in terms of temperature

conclude on the ground on the temperature requirements of selected in that industrial sectors are adapted to CSP technologies has been established. for low temperature the classic solar collector is needed for low medium temperature the additive CSP technology is small installation of parabolic reflectors have run a linear

linear lecture for high medium temperature

More than 250 degrees Celsius is this designs and large installation of parabolic

or linear linear reflector.

Different interviews were carried out she confirmed the results of the analysis.

Especially in interviews with the project of loppers and local interviews with the Moroccan industrial to indentify levers and by years, especially in the texts real food industries live cinematics in different regions in Morocco, especially macness fest through Casablanca and worship. The result of this interviews was very sharp

and civil berries have been identified through the interviews. The first one was the

no knowledge of the technology. No local offer for the installation of this type of system. return on investments too long binder regulatory framework, low qualification of facility staff to manage these facilities and investment costs to heights technical constraints of integration in the process. However, two main levers has been identified the financial assistance in the form of grants to reduce the cost of the initial investment for companies and reduce the time of return on investments. And also the implementation of pilot projects serving as benchmarks to show companies the function of the different solution

This is a comparative of a study in order to come to compare different technologies that can be used to produce to head or electricity on the industrial sits. The methodology was based on three main criteria land footprints, see lt reduction and liberalised causes for the co2 for the sorry for the parabolic trot, it, it was a notation of 3.2 and four for now it’s 2.9.

This is a comparative of an analysis of the difference technologies from the following graphs. We know that the use of our technologies parabolic and friend now clearly reflects the reduction of lamp footprints and co2

too, with a small difference in what quantity of heat produced.

For others technologies, the land footprint and co2 emitted are quite high compared to the quantity of his produce for Bo mass, the quantity of his produce is important wendland footprint remains to heights after the comparative analysis of the different technology. The conclusion is that the best technologies are CSP technologies with a minimum land footprint and co2 emission.

As you can see, this table is the estimates of potential markets and economic and environmental benefits of, of the CSP in Morocco and industry.

Also geographies

Also very important is a very important criteria for project profitability,

especially in words is that there is a zero percent variation compared to others.

And all this analysis shows that there is a real potential of small scale see a concentrated slow hit in Moroccan industry. Today the technology is mature and competitive. Sure UMass is still more competitive, but

that they must overcome some barriers to be included lots.

Specially final profitable T is still a little low for industrial actor to accept invest in a new and unknown technology. In fact, the cultural aspect

It’s very important in Morocco and companies are reluctant to bet on a technology they do not know this. This trust is a major barrier of the development of CSP in Morocco.

Now, I’m going to present the small grant programme is a part of a programme to support the development of the concentrated solar energy experts experts size and innovation in the MENA region. The solar cluster which supports with the World Bank lunches, the small grant programme.

The objective of of this programme is to select Moroccan industrials who will benefit from technical and financial support for the development of small scale. thermodynamic solar installations adapt to their needs heat and cold

The criteria of eligibility of this project is is an industrial sector company in partnership with a developer and the company would be registered in Morocco. And and also guaranteed to have a direct a direct relationship with the entity in charge of selecting the small small grant programme.

The project is is is for capacity isolation less than a foot 400 kilo water

in this contest is the Moroccan solar cluster organised seminar for the presentation of this programme. This day a load the official launch of the CSP call for projects and highlights in the training programme around industrial CSP model

And design offices following the the interview CSP calls for projects. Three projects with selected including the project that is the subject of the financing agreements, which rubba University with the collaboration with v2 mom.

The selects project is a parabolic solar collector the blocks for process hits.

In the commercial and industrial sector this system can generate thermal energy between 60 degree

and 250 degree.

A deal for process hit production in industries such as horse watchers GMG narration or heating

to maximise the reduction of energy costs in the commercial and industrial sectors and

Break a reduction of official used in boulders up to 80% of the project is in the film The preliminary fast and

of all the complete the complete solution and he’s waiting for financing of the of the word bank.

Thank you for your attention.

Thank you very much Fatima for your presentation. Now if you could stop sharing your screen and then that will take time for Canada to get ready to present the Academy, whatever you want to start sharing screen and not presenting.

So there are a few questions in the q&a box. So we will get them answered towards the end of the webinar. Once

to Canada has given his presentation and yeah, I encourage you to pose your questions as well. And

another reminder as well that you will get the slides and the video recording so

never never fair. How How you doing there? Hello Carol, have you found the your presentation? Yes Now I’m waiting for you. Okay, please.

Over over to you sorry. Okay.

So thank you, Carlos. So

I would start my presentation giving you an idea about

our Tunisian energy balance. Then I will present our national

objectives and commitment

in the renewable energy and energy efficiency field, and we’ll speak shortly about our national final energy share with the focus on industry. After that, I will talk

about the World Bank programme minute CSP keep

the csh initiative concentrated sauteed concert initiative in Tunisia and before concluding, I will present to you the new innovate transition plan which is a new financial tool to support this kind of project.

In the beginning, let me say a few words about the Tunisia and about the National Agency.

Energy conservation. Just notice in that Indonesia we have a one of the highest electrification ratio in Africa, so 990 9% as electrification ratio, and we have also 6500 the factories and 900 hotels. So, for the National Agency of energy conservation,

Vienna was one of the first National Agency in the region. It was created in 1985. And it is a public institution places under the ages of the ministry and charge of energy and the animals the role is to implement the state policy for energy conservation through promoting energy efficiency, renewable energies and energy substitution.

So, the thing is that energy balance is characterised by a continuous defeat since the year 2000. Reaching 4.9 million Don or equivalent in 2018. That’s mean that we import 51% of our energy need in 2018.

In the same time,

we developed several programme to promote renewable energy and then 2018. So we have until now have already more than 1 million solar thermal collected collect or unstyled in Tunisia and 62 megawatt PV connected PV installation connected to the grid.


mean about 32,000 houses with PV installation connected lead, in addition to a lot of offer great

baby installation in schools, in houses and also in


But this is not enough because we have a huge portion of solar energy in Tunisia we have a potential of more than 5 million square metres of saw thermal collector. And also we have the potential of 280 gigawatt of solar power generation. In the same time we’ll have a good experience in developing project to develop market

in a normal energy distributed technology like the prosonic

programme, which has been selected by the International Energy Agency programme as one of the top five best national solar thermal policies in the world as part of the solar heating and cooling solar world in 2017.

That’s why the Tunisian government


objectives and commitment by 2013. And the first one is the trees and solar plan approved by the government in July 2016.

The target of the Canadian solar brand is to have 30% of renewable electricity capacity by 2030. We will start from only 3% now to reach in 2013 30%. That’s mean to


Mega Watt in 2013 starting from almost 300 megawatts in 216. This is an ambitious target and the heavy investment needed estimated to 14,000 million

dinner with almost 80% of the of this investment will come from private sector.

For solar thermal sector, we have a goal to reach 3 million square metre residential sector by 2030 and 350,000 square metre to be a stud interestingly and underserved sector by 2030.

Plus a target in energy efficiency to reduce the demand of energy by 30% in 2030 all these

negated, led me to speak about of about our national determined contribution, fix it and approved by the parliament tourism parliament in October 2016 with a goal to reduce by 41% the Tunis and carbon intensity by 2030 with the reference of 2010, the energy sector in this in this target is the largest contributor to the NDC gold with 73% of emission reduction.

Now, if we speak about the national final energy share,

we can notice that the industrial sector in the second consumer Indonesia with 28%, but the most important indicator is that

78% of the understand final consumption is he is he yes he is he is not electricity. Even if all people speak about the electricity production and photovoltaic, the most important potential is in heat. It is the same worldwide, a definer conception worldwide. We have 83% of the world conception is heat and only 70% is electricity.

So, we have it in Asian industry with more than 75% of thermal energy consumption with measured use in medium temperature. And also we have an average of solar director radiation in Tunisia with about 2000 gigawatt hour per square metre period. That’s why the Tunisian government


target to instal 150,000 square metre in an industrial process he said the solar process heat national programme into Indonesia until 2030.

We start with the first project using solar thermal energy in industrial process with the plant in textile factory minaton you know the minaton textile factory maybe with 1000 square metre already installed

and it works

since 2018 but this plant is integrated to the washing process with with low temperature

this plant with a low the Benetton factory to save

More than 1500 on a given

because of the huge potential of the use of solar heat in medium temperature. So, we start with the support of the world banks around the minute CSP keep

programme in to develop the consult right do use of considered solar heat in industrial sector Indonesia. So, the two main the domain chapter in this programme is the determination of the detailed potential of using csh in the under several branches of food, textile, chemical obliques and paper industry, Indonesia and the most important

thing is a to identify some of key csh project in Tunisia

For small grant support

the approach adopted in the potential study the first step was to the selection of 130 manufacturer. So, this is a big consumer of energy. If you remember we have in Tunisia 6500 Industrial with more than 10 employer, but only 300 of this

industrial network, only 300 consume about 8% of all the industrial consumption. So, we choose 130 manufacturer from the biggest consumers from these 300 consumer. So, the second step was the data collection and the preliminary

study for 30 money factor from bricks for sex activity branches from paper branches from textile from chemical and food industry. And after that, we determined the detailed potential that can be mobilised in all the industrial sector. And finally, we selected to the two best cases where csh can be implemented. So in these two cases, which belong to food industry to diarrhoea industry and two textile industry, we did already the site visit and data collection and we are now doing the detailed feasibility study for this to understand

the result the first results of the potential study carried the in the framework of Amina CSP keep demonstrate that there is a

Potential conferment of 400,000 square metre that be can be installed in in industry Indonesia with 85% of this real potential

that can use csh technology, because the the process under the industry you are working in a medium temperature, they said the 30 under three we the

medium temperature working between 120 and 400 degree C. So, we can use front end technology or public draft technology to produce heat in these cases. So, we can produce heat directly with the directors team generation system or we we can appreciate

Water or we can integrate directly to the right temperature to the process.

So, the criteria applied to choose these

two cases where we will implement the solar process heats yes ash plant.

First of all, the first criteria is an important part of thermal need. So, and also the energy and all data availability

and when we apply these two criteria, we select the 30 sites 30 under three

and we collect the data to be sure that the operating temperature should be between 120 and 400 degrees.

And we visit the sites

to see how easy the integration

possibility is in the network of, of steam and the heat network of the company. And finally, we check the available surface the space that can accommodate the solar system of the needed capacity. The result of this selection and application of this criteria was the selection of two companies, milk factory, kala de Lis Danone in Cebu, xid and textile a jeans company called the name authority in in research bell in the north.

So the idea is something simple and the technology is a matter that is

More than 500 plants of solar process heat in the world. So, there is the non underneath consume LPG and oil. And with the solar part of these fossil fuel consumption will be switching to solar. So we’ll have as I said solar fuel saver. So, we select there is done on and then also because of they are strong commitment to our project CSS programme, and they believe on this

technology. And we are now waiting to the final result of the feasibility study to be the first industrials and remoting csh in Tunisia. But to do this, we need money we need a financial

instrument. So that’s why we

The new energy transition fund in Tunisia this tool created to stimulate the all the normal energy and energy efficiency action in Tunisia and especially for our case, the seska market. So, they understood I can have throw the chapter two of these energy transition fund 70% of subsidy with a ceiling of 250 units and 70% of all

in materials action, or other. He he can also have through chapter three of this ft

35% of investment as alone with the seal of 350 thousand dinner, plus 10% of subsidy with the ceiling of 200,000 dinner plus the material subsidies

But these are steel and shift vision and sufficient to be attractive to industrious for this kind of project.

That’s why we need that Mina CSP keep and the World Bank support us to create a long term and sustainable market for CSS technology. We the finance, finance mekinese adapted to our industrial sector starting from pilot project capacity capacity building action communication communication action to reach our objectives. In conclusion, there is an important real potential of csh Indonesia Conferment and the date by the minute CSP keep project. steam is widely use it as heat transfer we the medium temperature in today’s and under three consult right

collector can produce his team which can easily be integrated to the conventional energy infrastructure. concentrated solar heat collected technologies are available now, at more than $250,000 or equivalent of fuel and LPG

highly subsidised by the state. And we the cost highest with the highest cost done and natural gas is using in civil under several branches we can focus on these industry to increase the profitability and avoid the impact of the ship price of natural gas as the first step and from 2022 when we’ll have Indonesia, the real price of all new energy sources


We’ll have already some projects and we can develop the CSS plant if plant even in natural gas zone. So we need now to go to Investment and pilot project to develop the market Indonesia. That’s what we are waiting from Minnesota speaky. And thank you very much for your attention.

Thank you very much for your presentation very interesting.

And as you probably have realised, we started seeing questions coming through.

Actually, after kinda we could stop sharing the screen and that then the members of the audience will be able to see us as we as we speak.

There are a number of interesting questions as well. But I’d like to start with one of my own so what based in your experience so both of you have had concentrated

He programmes in your countries and what are the main barriers to doobies to concentrate the two solar heat systems and how could they How could this virus be removed?

I’m going to answer you this question because the study and the interviews with with industrials.

Answer this question is the first the first of our year is the low below, no knowledge of the technology.

There is a low because it’s a new technology This is a chronology we have the sensible lies industrials of this technology and also the too long investment. Today there is a too long investments and also do it

Business is cost is too hot. Today the CSP the cost is too high for industrials to invest on. And also there is some technical processes there there are very,

very of integration there. They’re very constraining all for for for the Moroccan companies. And also there is

there there there is low qualification. Today you have to qualify to have more engineers and more.

Morrow project managers that in Morocco that’s experts in CSP technology.

Right. And what kind of work have you how do you think fatimata beats solve these barriers could be mitigated

for us

The programme, the small grant programme, it’s one of

our supports, we support financially and technically all industrials that want to invest in this

in the CSP technologies for the moments the Moroccan solar cluster work hard on this programme to to evil with this district mancine Morocco

Thank you

Abdulkadir you’re very very quiet they’re very close to the screen so


my laptop is really

small little smaller laptops have a duty the question I’m to read the

the the what is right in

afraid some of the questions out loud and

Do you So, Fatima identifying some of the barriers that they have seen to csh? In Morocco, they included lack of awareness of the technology, long payback periods, high initial investment, also lack of qualified personnel. So, are they

similar to a virus you have found Indonesia as well?

Yes, it is a it is a it is almost similar. So we speak about the investment, initial investment is really heavy. So, we have a

link to this investment. And we don’t have a specific financial mechanism to support the implementation of the development of csh market. Also, we don’t have the necessary

No harm and expertise. So, we need the as I say

capacity building activities and

now one of the breeds in the high subsidy of the natural gas and other type of energy

that’s why this solar process heat programme is developed, developed slowly healing Tunisia, but the now we have the LPG price is the real price of mpg applied in Tunisia. So, the The turn is about the $500 and also for fuel and for natural gas.

So, we have a

we have an

discussion to have the real price in the market of natural going kinesia and to cancel the subsidy by 222. Now the gas is subsidised by about 50%

more or less, but there is a we are increasing the price of gas.

So, in 2018 and 2019

we increase by about 50% the price of natural gas Indonesia applied to industry and hotels. And we continue this strategy until having the real price applied in the gas and energy market in Tunisia. So, the same time we are looking to to work back to support us to have a

Specific small grant or specific programme to support finance meant and to support the market creation in in solar, consolidated heating Indonesia and industry entities.

Thank you, Tara. So we have a question by Elena quadros. And she’s asking precisely when you remove the fossil fuel subsidies, how much will fossil fuel price prices increase and whether the price increase food bring about good made csh more viable more competitive option for industry? Yes, yes.

Especially for natural gas. As I said, it is a subsidised by about 50%. So

it will be the the increasing

The increase in the cost of natural colour will be almost 50%. But

every year we will have the real price of natural gas in the energy market starting from 2022 This is the discussion that we have the several meeting and

with all the public operator in energy sector

and normally it will be applied.

Okay. Right. So let’s move on to some of the other questions we have in the from the audience. So, one of them is regarding the use of thermal energy storage. So when you have lukather technology, and both of you have the catalogue,

have spoken with a number of industrial users have they mentioned that they need

energy at a time when the world that the sun is not shining and also a storage of viable option in their like short to medium term for csh industry


please yes okay. So, for energy storage,

there is to option there is a some plants of csh comfort saw heat with a storage and without stores for example, if we have direct steam in a direct steam generation can be directly integrated to this in network and regulation between the boiler and the solar energy can produce the fix in the top

pressure and

and needed temperature and pressure that we we need but a we can have it is it is recommended to have


in the our solar considerate solar heat plan in direct steam generation that we should separate the divide part of the steam to

separate the steam to the water before

integrate into the steam network. There is two other option

that go where we can apply the the solar proceed plan. We can preheat the fitting water and then this case, we need the storage to put the

Water preheated by solar,

the boiler we take water from these

water pre heated by solar energy and

the last option is to integrate the

the the heat the solar heat directly in the needed temperature and barometer and temperature and pressure directly to the process. So, but

don’t forget that the this is an additional cost. This daughters we will have which stores will have an additional cost by

almost 20 to 30%. I think he in this CS h land that’s why we need a simulation taken

Nicola and economical simulation we the storage and without storage

to choose between the two. The two


solution thank of the kind of fatty modular and you want to say something Yes, I’m

totally with Mr back push. This is basic knowledge energy storage is a form of Hades, which allows for storage capacity is greater than those of batteries. And CSP plans control the heat obtained by concentrated the solar addition and large tanks filled storage for several hours or of this and can be turned into electricity when the weather is cloudy or during a peak of

Action usually at a desk.

That’s all.

Thank you.

Thank you. Sorry, we don’t speak about electricity it’s not models of storage or storage to have

to produce electricity the storage of steam or storage of heat. So,

that contain pre heated water that contain steam directly generated by concentrated solar heat or and direct generation if the, the field with thermal fluid will be on thermal oil.

So, that’s a good point. Actually, I’m going to there are few questions about, you know, the internal rate of return about the financials of these projects. And I think that could be summarised in

In one question, so what is the It seems that the world one question one issue, it seems that the payback time period for bc systems is longer than most companies are willing to accept. So, you know, how could you mitigate this? There are other industries where they have actually have business models where the companies don’t have to own the system they could pay as you go. Is there anyone looking at trying to deploy that kind of similar business model in Tunisia or in or in Morocco? You know,

okay. So for us, it is clear so, the first results on the to feasibility study conducted by

front offer is expire

these gentlemen on Dyneema to demonstrate that if we don’t have the

support of the World Bank Amina CSP will have a payback time about

six to eight years as a payback time period. So in this case we’ll have only the support of the energy transition fine and it’s not really attractive, but if you have the support of

Mina CSP or other donors

will have the the simulation say that will have almost three years other payback time in these two pilot project. Okay, so the payback time is between three to eight years as a conclusion. And the the IRL is about 15% to 18

18% and more.

Okay, and have you approached? There are various international organisations that provide these kind of financing? I’m assuming that you probably have approach all of it right. Yes. So, we start to,



some proposal

with the support of the World Bank to spam as mob line for example, for example, but also will,

will approach other donors to,

to have

financial support and to grow

specific financial mechanism for this kind of project. But we don’t have until now, the

approval of any of these donors.

Right. And Fatima, if you’d like to add to these, these question on vino baseness models for a way to mitigate the mechanisms, one of which could be a concession of financing, do you reduce the payback time of these projects and make them more palatable to industrialists?

As Mr. Bush said, Today, without the support of the World Bank, it’s very difficult to have the projects on CSP technology with high level

return investments. Today, we need the support of


of our banks to to invest in this technology.

Right Well, thank you for

much. I have I see lots of questions in the q&a box, but I am afraid that we are, we have ran out of time.

You know, so, like all good things, these webinar must also come to an end. So I’d like to thank everyone in the audience and you, Fatima and have doTERRA for sharing some time with us letting us know what the situation is in a new countries. any parting words from from you? Let’s start with you, Fatima.

I want to thank you of this webinar. It was very interesting, and I really appreciate your invitation. And I hope that spectators have

some information in the opportunities of applications in CSP in Morocco. Thank you very much. Thank you. Fatima, Abdul Qader any parting words

Yes, so I want to thank all the audience and I want to thank you, Carlos and all the other stuff. So, I say that I am convinced, and I believe the development of concentrated solar heat.

So, I start working in this field, the since 2010. And it’s time to have

long term market Indonesia and

I will never give up. And then we have this because

if we look to the energy consumption share of the industry, the huge potential is in the heat, not in electricity and we have a lot of solution to explore explored these huge potential and to the

look real wide

csh market in Tunisia, and thank you again for all of you. Thank you for the amount. So

thank you very much to both of you. And finally, at Thank you do the World Bank main sex beekeeper programme for making this webinar possible. And to everyone in the audience. As you have seen probably in the chat box, we have a number of webinars coming up, which I hope you can also take part in. So well thank you very much. Have a good evening, good morning, wherever you are.

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